virus: the human price?

From: Dr Sebby (drsebby@hotmail.com)
Date: Sun Feb 08 2004 - 03:20:37 MST

  • Next message: Erik Aronesty: "Re: virus: Life is not a game"

    ...thinking about an old post i was reading (something about the poor
    getting poorer as the modern political machine helps the rich get richer), i
    thought.."well, that really does seem to be the case...and the only way it
    is ever dealt with is if the poor and dumb get SOOO upset that they are
    finally driven to massive revolt since the threat of death is nearly
    equitable to the life they are living."

    ...so i thought about the true economics of power. it occurs to me that
    money is time, and time is essentially life to us. so how much money does
    the average human cost in terms of power brokering? example: if i wanted to
    overthrow the current federal government and overturn the wealthiest
    families that have a stranglehold on this country's economy and society, how
    many followers would i need that were not afraid of seriously tempting death
    or imprisonment? how many peoples' ultimate sacrifice would be required to
    win a power battle against the hundreds of billions of dollars available to
    my opposition's forces(whatever they may be)? it's a much easier equation
    to play with if dealing with a smaller...relatively solitary country. but
    still, i would think that some approximate value could be generated for a
    human life in terms of power wielded.

    any ideas?

    DrSebby.
    "Courage...and shuffle the cards".

    ----Original Message Follows----
    From: "rhinoceros" <rhinoceros@freemail.gr>
    Reply-To: virus@lucifer.com
    To: virus@lucifer.com
    Subject: virus: Re: What does it mean to be me?
    Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2003 19:53:11 -0700

    Coffee-house philosophy time...

    The biggest mystery for me about the "illusion of the self" is not about
    just any self but about mine.

    I mean, I can easily talk about selves in general, and I seem to understand
    how selves depend on memories and how a core self can be instantly created
    upon interaction with things even in the absence of memories, and what has
    been said about the role of self-reference, complexity, competing modules
    in the brain and everything. However...

    The question of identity is weird. We do know that millions, trillions, and
    gazillions of sperm cells never get to become selves. So, our selves seem to
    be very lucky to be the ones they are, on this planet and in this particular
    century. It is luck beyond probability theory, because we haven't drawn a
    lottery ticket out of any repository of souls -- we have drawn it out of the
    infinite posibilities of forging a self.

    On second thought, however, the fact that our selves were forged rather than
    picked out by luck seems to be a way out of the metaphysical curiosities: We
    just came to be. But this is not so clear any more when we get back to the
    question of identity -- when I think that I am talking about *my own* self.

    Think of it: You are sitting over there reading this, with *your own* self
    forged in a complex process. The probabilities that the person who
    experiences this "illusion of the self" would be someone else and not "you"
    are overwhelming. Still, it is "you" sitting there and experiencing "the
    illusion of the self", on planet Earth, in the 21st century of all
    centuries. The lottery is back, along with Descartes' "I think therefore I
    am".

    I think we have a long way to go and many more models to try before "the
    illusion of the self" is really understood well enough to be reconciled with
    our perception.

    ----
    This message was posted by rhinoceros to the Virus 2003 board on Church of 
    Virus BBS.
    <http://virus.lucifer.com/bbs/index.php?board=54;action=display;threadid=29630>
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