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simul
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virus: Nick Berg email I got
« on: 2004-05-14 21:57:58 »
Reply with quote

This came from an anonymous source. Not saying I believe all of this, but... have any of you ever seen “The Life of David Gale?”. Maybe there's a parallel here?

Anyway:

------snip------

Many many things have come out of the Nick Berg situation. Ive learned that
1)  The killer was wearing a gold ring...Muslim men cannot wear gold
rings,in fact cannot touch gold at all.
(2) His parents and friend seem to think that Nick was held my Us
forces.Even Emails proving it are ignored by major media.
(3) The posture of 'killers',mannerisms,bulletproof vests on them,suggest a
'thug' atmosphere,not Middle Eastern terrorists,and the ORANGE PRISONER
suitwhich seems like the same ones issued at Abu Gharab...all fishy
facts.Also colors of walls the same exact color of walls in Abu Gharab...Oh
also the killers were White and Fat and recited from the piece of paper they
were holding ina dialect that many in the Arab world say was poorly
imitated.Oh also the chair Nick was sitting in was the SAME chair in a
picture of Abu Gharab.See SAME CHAIR web
site....http://marc.perkel.com/archives/000233.html

Oh,sorry,also the killers have WHITE SHOES on.just a little fishy
(4) Nick seemed dead already,there was no movement from him at any time
during the 'cutting'.
(5) And also not much blood considering the amount that would come out from
a beheading.
(6) Nicks dad,Michael was put on a hate-list (much like the stupid calls you
used to get).His dad was an advocate of the anti-war group,and was
threatened weeks before this had happened.
(7) The location of where Nick Berg was being 'detained' and what he was
being detained for is still an unknown.
( His father,Michael, has been recently quoted in saying that 'I blame
President Bush and Rumsfeld for my sons killing'

  This is a story that wont go away i think.These parents wont forget how
the army didnt answer questions and theyre son couldnt talk to a lawyer,then
ends up in 'al-quaCIAda's' hands and gets shipped home in a box.

I cant sleep.I know its true.
                                                -B
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First, read Bruce Sterling's "Distraction", and then read http://electionmethods.org.
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18680476 18680476    dr_sebby drsebby
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RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #1 on: 2004-05-15 00:06:26 »
Reply with quote

....not to jump to conclusions but:  two things i took note of when i saw
the full video....

1. how absolutely, incredibly still he was whilst sitting in front of his
killers.

2. no blood really seen.  when his head was held up in front of the camera,
for a few seconds, there was only one 'glop' of blood/tissue to fall from
his severed neck, and absolutely none spewing from the actual moments of
decapitation.

3. the video quality was incredibly poor.

4. he didnt seem to make any attempts to scream or open his mouth even when
being forced down on his side or during the cutting.

....maybe this is just another 'we didnt land on the moon' theory, but i
wouldnt throw it out the door just yet.



DrSebby.
"Courage...and shuffle the cards".





----Original Message Follows----
From: "Erik Aronesty" <erik@zoneedit.com>
Reply-To: virus@lucifer.com
To: "Church of Virus" <virus@lucifer.com>
Subject: virus: Nick Berg email I got
Date: Fri, 14 May 2004 21:57:58 -0400

This came from an anonymous source. Not saying I believe all of this, but...
have any of you ever seen “The Life of David Gale?”. Maybe there's a
parallel here?

Anyway:

------snip------

Many many things have come out of the Nick Berg situation. Ive learned that
1)  The killer was wearing a gold ring...Muslim men cannot wear gold
rings,in fact cannot touch gold at all.
(2) His parents and friend seem to think that Nick was held my Us
forces.Even Emails proving it are ignored by major media.
(3) The posture of 'killers',mannerisms,bulletproof vests on them,suggest a
'thug' atmosphere,not Middle Eastern terrorists,and the ORANGE PRISONER
suitwhich seems like the same ones issued at Abu Gharab...all fishy
facts.Also colors of walls the same exact color of walls in Abu Gharab...Oh
also the killers were White and Fat and recited from the piece of paper they
were holding ina dialect that many in the Arab world say was poorly
imitated.Oh also the chair Nick was sitting in was the SAME chair in a
picture of Abu Gharab.See SAME CHAIR web
site....http://marc.perkel.com/archives/000233.html

Oh,sorry,also the killers have WHITE SHOES on.just a little fishy
(4) Nick seemed dead already,there was no movement from him at any time
during the 'cutting'.
(5) And also not much blood considering the amount that would come out from
a beheading.
(6) Nicks dad,Michael was put on a hate-list (much like the stupid calls you
used to get).His dad was an advocate of the anti-war group,and was
threatened weeks before this had happened.
(7) The location of where Nick Berg was being 'detained' and what he was
being detained for is still an unknown.
( His father,Michael, has been recently quoted in saying that 'I blame
President Bush and Rumsfeld for my sons killing'

    This is a story that wont go away i think.These parents wont forget how
the army didnt answer questions and theyre son couldnt talk to a lawyer,then
ends up in 'al-quaCIAda's' hands and gets shipped home in a box.

I cant sleep.I know its true.
                                                  -B
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RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #2 on: 2004-05-15 03:07:36 »
Reply with quote

Erik Aronesty
Sent: 15 May 2004 03:58 AM

This came from an anonymous source. Not saying I believe all of this, but...
have any of you ever seen "The Life of David Gale?". Maybe there's a
parallel here?

[Blunderov] You have done nothing to allay to dark suspicions that have been
lurking in the back of my mind Erik. A black op? Naah can't be...

It struck me at the time I saw the video (not all of it - just the TX
version) that Nick Berg seemed curiously immobile. I thought 'At least they
drugged him'.

And I still can't find a translation of the tape.

Very peculiar. An American Jew wanders around Iraq, unescorted, for three
months.

Naah, can't be.

Best Regards







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RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #3 on: 2004-05-15 03:28:56 »
Reply with quote

[Bluderov] Curioser and curioser.
Best Regards
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/05/11/iraq/main616842.shtml

<snip>
CBS News National Security Correspondent David Martin reports U.S. officials
said the FBI questioned Berg in 2002 after a computer password he used in
college turned up in the possession of Zacarias Moussaoui, the al Qaeda
operative arrested shortly before Sept. 11 for his suspicious activity at a
flight school in Minnesota.

Moussaoui is now in federal custody and awaiting trial on conspiracy charges
stemming from the Sept. 11 attacks.

"The suggestion that Mr. Berg was in some way involved in terrorist
activity, or may have been linked in some way to terrorist activity, is a
suggestion that we do not have any ability to support and we do not believe
is a valid one," Ashcroft said at a news conference.

The 2002 investigation determined that an e-mail address once used by Berg
apparently was obtained by the Moussaoui acquaintances while Berg was
briefly an engineering student at the University of Oklahoma in 1999.

Berg, a small businessman who went to Iraq seeking a role in reconstruction,
was found dead May 8. On May 11, an Islamic Web site posted video in which
masked militants beheaded him. The CIA has identified the speaker in the
video - the man who murdered Berg - as Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, a terrorist
suspected in numerous attacks in Iraq.

In the wake of Berg's gruesome murder, the past link to Moussaoui seems a
stranger-than-fiction coincidence - an American who inadvertently gave away
his computer password to one suspected al Qaeda operative is later murdered
by another notorious al Qaeda operative, Zarqawi.

The slain man's father, Michael Berg, told reporters that his son met
Moussaoui while riding the bus to classes, and had allowed the suspect to
use his computer.

But the 2002 FBI interview could explain the bureau's interest in Berg while
he was detained by authorities in Iraq shortly before the militants
kidnapped and killed him.

Berg was picked up on March 24 and released on April 6. The details of that
detention are the subject of a dispute between the Berg family and the U.S.
government.

The family contends Berg was detained by the U.S. military, and even filed
suit seeking his release on April 5. The U.S. military says Iraqi police
detained him. Iraqi police deny that.

To back its claims that Berg was in U.S. custody, the family gave The
Associated Press copies of e-mails from Beth A. Payne, the U.S. consular
officer in Iraq.

"I have confirmed that your son, Nick, is being detained by the U.S.
military in Mosul. He is safe. He was picked up approximately one week ago.
We will try to obtain additional information regarding his detention and a
contact person you can communicate with directly," Payne wrote to Berg's
father on April 1.

Payne repeated that Berg was "being detained by the U.S. military" in an
e-mail the same day to Berg's mother, Suzanne. The next day, Payne wrote
that she was still trying to find a local contact for the family, but added
that "given the security situation in Iraq it is not easy."

The government says the e-mail from Payne was false. State Department
spokeswoman Kelly Shannon said Payne's information came from the Coalition
Provisional Authority. The authority did not tell Payne until April 7 that
Berg had been held by Iraqi police and not the U.S. military, she said.

"As Mr. Berg had been released, the consular officer did not convey this
information to the family because he was released, thankfully," Shannon
said. "And we thought he was on his way."

Coalition spokesman Dan Senor said Wednesday that Iraqi police arrested Berg
in Mosul on March 24 because local authorities believed he may have been
involved in "suspicious activities."

In Mosul, police chief Maj. Gen. Mohammed Khair al-Barhawi insisted Thursday
that his department had never arrested Berg and maintained he had no
knowledge of the case.

During his detention, Berg was questioned by FBI agents three times.

Berg is believed to have been kidnapped days after Iraqi police or coalition
forces released him. The family has blamed the government for keeping him in
custody for too long while anti-American violence escalated in Iraq.

Shortly before Berg's disappearance, he was warned by the FBI that Iraq was
too volatile a place for unprotected American civilians and that he could be
harmed, a senior FBI official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said
Wednesday.

Officials said the U.S. government warned Berg to leave Iraq, and offered
him a flight out of the country, a month before his grisly death.

The Bergs said they want to know if the government had received an offer to
trade Iraqi prisoners for Nicholas Berg. On the videotape of his death,
Berg's killers made a reference to a trade offer, but U.S. officials have
said they knew of no such offer.


Michael Berg said he wanted to hear President Bush address the issue.

"I would like to ask him if it is true that al Qaeda offered to trade my
son's life for the life of another person," Michael Berg said. "And if that
is true, well, I need that information. . and I think the people of the
United States of America need to know what the fate of their sons and
daughters might be in the hands of the Bush administration."
</snip>



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18680476 18680476    dr_sebby drsebby
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RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #4 on: 2004-05-15 03:54:30 »
Reply with quote

...this probably means nothing, but it's interesting that the two different
sites i saw the video on, i found it impossible to fast forward it, replay
little bits of it, or save it to my computer.  just play it through from the
beginning.

...the vid quality is soooo poor it's bizarre.  one movement , a sort of
shoulder shrugging is done about 3 times, but is oddly 'jerk-like'.  there
appears to be very very little blinking going on, but its so fuzzy that it
could easily have been edited in.

....still skeptical, but interested in hearing more theories.



DrSebby.
"Courage...and shuffle the cards".





----Original Message Follows----
From: "Blunderov" <squooker@mweb.co.za>
Reply-To: virus@lucifer.com
To: <virus@lucifer.com>
Subject: RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 09:07:36 +0200

Erik Aronesty
Sent: 15 May 2004 03:58 AM

This came from an anonymous source. Not saying I believe all of this, but...
have any of you ever seen "The Life of David Gale?". Maybe there's a
parallel here?

[Blunderov] You have done nothing to allay to dark suspicions that have been
lurking in the back of my mind Erik. A black op? Naah can't be...

It struck me at the time I saw the video (not all of it - just the TX
version) that Nick Berg seemed curiously immobile. I thought 'At least they
drugged him'.

And I still can't find a translation of the tape.

Very peculiar. An American Jew wanders around Iraq, unescorted, for three
months.

Naah, can't be.

Best Regards







---
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"courage and shuffle the cards..."
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RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #5 on: 2004-05-15 04:34:45 »
Reply with quote

Dr Sebby
Sent: 15 May 2004 09:55 AM
To: virus@lucifer.com
Subject: RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got

...this probably means nothing, but it's interesting that the two different
sites i saw the video on, i found it impossible to fast forward it, replay
little bits of it, or save it to my computer.  just play it through from the

beginning.

...the vid quality is soooo poor it's bizarre.  one movement , a sort of
shoulder shrugging is done about 3 times, but is oddly 'jerk-like'.  there
appears to be very very little blinking going on, but its so fuzzy that it
could easily have been edited in.

....still skeptical, but interested in hearing more theories.

[Blunderov] Yes. It was the lack of blinking that made me think drugs. And
when the executioner pulled him over on to his left side by his hair, Berg
looked as immobile as a dummy. He did not seem startled at the sudden
assault; his head and eyes remained fixed on the camera.

Possibly he was paralysed with terror. But the eyes didn't move...

Best Regards



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18680476 18680476    dr_sebby drsebby
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RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #6 on: 2004-05-15 06:59:29 »
Reply with quote

....I also noticed (before considering that he had been in a v.sunny climate
for a while) how pasty he looked.  the best term i can come up with is
"waxy".

....regardless if this is bullshit, it is also interesting to note that not
one american news service has mentioned the possibility of it being fake.

....isn't it out of the ordinary for such an action to be denied by the
local thugs?  apparently they claim that the guy who supposedly wielded the
knife was killed in march!?  after the recent FCC strongarming by the bush
cabinet, i really dont see our news as a credible source of much anymore.

....did you know that condaleeza rice has an oil tanker named after her? 
funny that that hasnt been mentioned in the 'news'.  it would make a great
'human interest' story=)



DrSebby.
"Courage...and shuffle the cards".





----Original Message Follows----
From: "Blunderov" <squooker@mweb.co.za>
Reply-To: virus@lucifer.com
To: <virus@lucifer.com>
Subject: RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 10:34:45 +0200

Dr Sebby
Sent: 15 May 2004 09:55 AM
To: virus@lucifer.com
Subject: RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got

...this probably means nothing, but it's interesting that the two different
sites i saw the video on, i found it impossible to fast forward it, replay
little bits of it, or save it to my computer.  just play it through from the

beginning.

...the vid quality is soooo poor it's bizarre.  one movement , a sort of
shoulder shrugging is done about 3 times, but is oddly 'jerk-like'.  there
appears to be very very little blinking going on, but its so fuzzy that it
could easily have been edited in.

....still skeptical, but interested in hearing more theories.

[Blunderov] Yes. It was the lack of blinking that made me think drugs. And
when the executioner pulled him over on to his left side by his hair, Berg
looked as immobile as a dummy. He did not seem startled at the sudden
assault; his head and eyes remained fixed on the camera.

Possibly he was paralysed with terror. But the eyes didn't move...

Best Regards



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RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #7 on: 2004-05-15 08:44:47 »
Reply with quote

Jeez guys, if you read my damned (admittedly poor) Weblog you would have
been on this stuff 2 days ago!

http://www.limbicnutrition.com/blog/archives/021276.html

My theory is that Berg was already dead when his head was severed. I think
that he was abducted and killed by rebels/al-Qaeda, but that then slaughter
element was just for effect.

Regards

Jonathan

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-virus@lucifer.com [mailto:owner-virus@lucifer.com] On Behalf Of
Dr Sebby
Sent: 15 May 2004 11:59
To: virus@lucifer.com
Subject: RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got

....I also noticed (before considering that he had been in a v.sunny climate

for a while) how pasty he looked.  the best term i can come up with is
"waxy".

....regardless if this is bullshit, it is also interesting to note that not
one american news service has mentioned the possibility of it being fake.

....isn't it out of the ordinary for such an action to be denied by the
local thugs?  apparently they claim that the guy who supposedly wielded the
knife was killed in march!?  after the recent FCC strongarming by the bush
cabinet, i really dont see our news as a credible source of much anymore.

....did you know that condaleeza rice has an oil tanker named after her? 
funny that that hasnt been mentioned in the 'news'.  it would make a great
'human interest' story=)



DrSebby.
"Courage...and shuffle the cards".





----Original Message Follows----
From: "Blunderov" <squooker@mweb.co.za>
Reply-To: virus@lucifer.com
To: <virus@lucifer.com>
Subject: RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 10:34:45 +0200

Dr Sebby
Sent: 15 May 2004 09:55 AM
To: virus@lucifer.com
Subject: RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got

...this probably means nothing, but it's interesting that the two different
sites i saw the video on, i found it impossible to fast forward it, replay
little bits of it, or save it to my computer.  just play it through from the

beginning.

...the vid quality is soooo poor it's bizarre.  one movement , a sort of
shoulder shrugging is done about 3 times, but is oddly 'jerk-like'.  there
appears to be very very little blinking going on, but its so fuzzy that it
could easily have been edited in.

....still skeptical, but interested in hearing more theories.

[Blunderov] Yes. It was the lack of blinking that made me think drugs. And
when the executioner pulled him over on to his left side by his hair, Berg
looked as immobile as a dummy. He did not seem startled at the sudden
assault; his head and eyes remained fixed on the camera.

Possibly he was paralysed with terror. But the eyes didn't move...

Best Regards



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Blunderov
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RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #8 on: 2004-05-15 08:50:25 »
Reply with quote

Dr Sebby
Sent: 15 May 2004 12:59 PM

....I also noticed (before considering that he had been in a v.sunny climate

for a while) how pasty he looked.  the best term i can come up with is
"waxy".

....regardless if this is bullshit, it is also interesting to note that not
one american news service has mentioned the possibility of it being fake.

....isn't it out of the ordinary for such an action to be denied by the
local thugs?  apparently they claim that the guy who supposedly wielded the
knife was killed in march!?  after the recent FCC strongarming by the bush
cabinet, i really dont see our news as a credible source of much anymore.

....did you know that condaleeza rice has an oil tanker named after her? 
funny that that hasnt been mentioned in the 'news'.  it would make a great
'human interest' story=)

[Blunderov] Take it from whence it comes, as the saying goes. But the more
one sniffs the smellier it gets. To me the rigidity of the Berg in the video
is not inconsistent with rigor mortis. Either that or he was stoned to the
gills.

The point that follows about the boiler suits is not that convincing to me
unless they are for some reason particularly hard to come by.

The suggestion in this article about the lack of blood (I haven't, luckily,
seen that much of the video) if true, is highly significant.

The most telling point to me is the one about why Abu Musab al-Zarqawi would
even want to cover his face. Even if he isn't already dead he would hardly
be planning on being taken alive.

Hmm. Plainly there is a lot to know that we know we don't know. Maybe even
some things that we don't know that we don't know?

Best Regards

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/4FFA61A3-9C33-4597-A8D9-8079E91F2784.
htm

<q>
Bloggers doubt Berg execution video
By Lawrence Smallman 

Friday 14 May 2004, 0:08 Makka Time, 21:08 GMT 


Was this really Nick Berg's last moment or was he killed earlier?

Revolting millions around the world, the video footage of an American
citizen's execution has also raised numerous questions concerning its
authenticity.

Even at first glance, internet bloggers were asking on Thursday why Nick
Berg was wearing an orange jumpsuit - just like US prisoners wear.

Other net surfers point to the unlikely timing of the executioner's dubbed
announcement that Berg was to die for "Iraqi prisoner abuse".

Berg was last seen alive on 10 April, when his father Michael Berg believes
he was killed - two weeks before the Abu Ghraib prisoner abuse scandal broke
in the world's media.

Some discussions focus on the timing of the video's release - guaranteed to
divert attention from the outrage over US abuse of Iraqis.

Video oddities

There are plenty of questions raised concerning the video too. The body is
completely motionless even as the knife is brought to bear - not so much as
an instinctive wriggle.

More graphically, some claim that cutting the throat's artery would cause a
significant amount of blood to gush out. But little emerges and when the
head was raised - not a drop of blood is seen to fall.

"That's really what cost my son his life, the fact that the United States
government saw fit to keep him in custody for 13 days without any of his due
process(es) or civil rights" Michael Berg,victim's father

In a possible explanation, one discussion room member suggested that Berg
was killed and then beheaded later.

However, the circumstances of the video release are also strange. A Reuters
journalist in Dubai first named the Muntada al-Ansar al-Islami website as
the source for the video - at www.al-ansar.biz.

Although the site has now been shut down, Aljazeera.net looked at the site
within 90 minutes of the story breaking - and could find no such video
footage.

But Fox News, CNN and the BBC were all able to download the footage from the
Arabic-only website and report the story within the hour.

Days before death

Other questions presented by bloggers are Berg's peculiar circumstances in
the weeks before his death. Why would a private Jewish American citizen
choose to wander around Iraq by himself?

Additionally, some have pointed out that his last email on 6 April to his
family stated he wished to return home as soon as possible - yet the FBI
claims he refused an offer of help to get home.


Some claim the face in the video looks remarkably unlike Berg's

In the wider press, FBI involvement has also generated much discussion as to
why Berg was really arrested and detained for two weeks in Mosul.

The unemployed visitor was suspicious enough for Iraqi police to arrest him
- with FBI knowledge.

He had only just been released from prison where he had been held for 13
days by Iraqi police for reasons he said he did not know.

Family blames government

A US newspaper claims an official familiar with the case knew that FBI
agents had interrogated Berg, but had left him for two weeks because he was
in Iraqi - not American - custody.

But the official was unable to clarify the legal difference between the two,
given the US occupation.

On 5 April, Berg's family filed a suit in federal court in Philadelphia -
contending that their son was being held illegally by the US military in
Iraq. The next day, he was released and left to get himself home.

The last time the family heard from him was on 9 April. His headless body
was found near Mosul on 8 May.

"That's really what cost my son his life, the fact that the United States
government saw fit to keep him in custody for 13 days without any of his due
process or civil rights," Michael Berg said.

Final question

Some bloggers focused on the accent of the purported executioner. Many deny
the accent is either Iraqi or Jordanian - while claims the voice is Egyptian
or Iranian have been made.

The Jordanian accused of the beheading Berg is himself believed to have been
killed in March, according to two Islamist groups.

An eight-page leaflet circulated this week in Falluja said Abu Musab
al-Zarqawi was killed in the Sulaimaniya mountains of northern Iraq during a
US bombing.

But even if it were the Jordanian, one discussion room member observes his
face is so well-known that "why would he bother to cover it?"
Aljazeera</q>


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Re:virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #9 on: 2004-05-15 10:21:53 »
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[rhinoceros]
I did some googling on A-Zarqawi when I noticed some weak points in the first CNN story about Nick Berg. The results I got were rather contradictory, so I left them for when they make more sense. Since it was brought up, I am dumping some links here in reverse chronological order:


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3483089.stm
Profile: Abu Musab al-Zarqawi
May 12, 2004

<snip>
But some analysts contested the claim, pointing to Mr Zarqawi's historical rivalry with Bin Laden.
<snip>


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4446084/
Iraq militants claim al-Zarqawi is dead
March  04, 2004

<snip>
Abu Musab al-Zarqawi was killed in the Sulaimaniyah mountains of northern Iraq “during the American bombing there,” according to a statement circulated in Fallujah this week and signed by the “Leadership of the Allahu Akbar Mujahedeen.”
<snip>


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4431601/
Avoiding attacking suspected terrorist mastermind
March  02, 2004

<snip>
With Tuesday’s attacks, Abu Musab Zarqawi, a Jordanian militant with ties to al-Qaida, is now blamed for more than 700 terrorist killings in Iraq. But NBC News has learned that long before the war the Bush administration had several chances to wipe out his terrorist operation and perhaps kill Zarqawi himself — but never pulled the trigger.
<snip>


http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/library/news/iraq/2004/02/040212-al-zarqawi.htm
Text from Abu Mus’ab al-Zarqawi Letter
Coalition Provisional Authority, February 12, 2004

<snip>
The Shi`a: [They are] the insurmountable obstacle, the lurking snake, the crafty and malicious scorpion, the spying enemy, and the penetrating venom.
<snip>


[rhinoceros]
In the last one, Al-Zarqwawi is purported to promote sectarian war among Muslims, the Sunites against the Shiites. No such thing happened nor was attempted. Either the document was a forgery or written by an agent provocateur or Al-Zarqawi is/was just plain irrelevant to Iraq.

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Re:virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #10 on: 2004-05-15 10:32:30 »
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[[ author reputation (1.72) beneath threshold (3)... display message ]]

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Re: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #11 on: 2004-05-15 10:49:03 »
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He looked drugged, like after torture or interrogation.
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First, read Bruce Sterling's "Distraction", and then read http://electionmethods.org.
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RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #12 on: 2004-05-15 12:31:05 »
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rhinoceros
Sent: 15 May 2004 04:22 PM

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4431601/


Avoiding attacking suspected terrorist mastermind
March  02, 2004

<snip>
With Tuesday's attacks, Abu Musab Zarqawi, a Jordanian militant with ties to
al-Qaida, is now blamed for more than 700 terrorist killings in Iraq. But
NBC News has learned that long before the war the Bush administration had
several chances to wipe out his terrorist operation and perhaps kill Zarqawi
himself - but never pulled the trigger.
<snip>

[Blunderov] Fascinating post, which I haven't finished yet, but this quote
from the above link puzzles me.
<snip>
Military officials insist their case for attacking Zarqawi's operation was
airtight, but the administration feared destroying the terrorist camp in
Iraq could undercut its case for war against Saddam.
</snip>

Apart from the huge irony of 'undercut its case for war against Saddam',
this seems strange. Would the existence of this Ricin factory not have been
unequivocal proof of the contention that Saddam had links to al Qaida? And a
very worthy target not to mention photo opportunity to boot?
Best Regards





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RE: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #13 on: 2004-05-15 12:50:55 »
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The text you quote below is not from the link you
included.  Where did it come from?

--Eva

--- Blunderov <squooker@mweb.co.za> wrote:
> [Bluderov] Curioser and curioser.
> Best Regards
>
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/05/11/iraq/main616842.shtml

>
> <snip>
> CBS News National Security Correspondent David
> Martin reports U.S. officials
> said the FBI questioned Berg in 2002 after a
> computer password he used in
> college turned up in the possession of Zacarias
> Moussaoui, the al Qaeda
> operative arrested shortly before Sept. 11 for his
> suspicious activity at a
> flight school in Minnesota.
>
> Moussaoui is now in federal custody and awaiting
> trial on conspiracy charges
> stemming from the Sept. 11 attacks.
>
> "The suggestion that Mr. Berg was in some way
> involved in terrorist
> activity, or may have been linked in some way to
> terrorist activity, is a
> suggestion that we do not have any ability to
> support and we do not believe
> is a valid one," Ashcroft said at a news conference.
>
>
> The 2002 investigation determined that an e-mail
> address once used by Berg
> apparently was obtained by the Moussaoui
> acquaintances while Berg was
> briefly an engineering student at the University of
> Oklahoma in 1999.
>
> Berg, a small businessman who went to Iraq seeking a
> role in reconstruction,
> was found dead May 8. On May 11, an Islamic Web site
> posted video in which
> masked militants beheaded him. The CIA has
> identified the speaker in the
> video - the man who murdered Berg - as Abu Musab
> al-Zarqawi, a terrorist
> suspected in numerous attacks in Iraq.
>
> In the wake of Berg's gruesome murder, the past link
> to Moussaoui seems a
> stranger-than-fiction coincidence - an American who
> inadvertently gave away
> his computer password to one suspected al Qaeda
> operative is later murdered
> by another notorious al Qaeda operative, Zarqawi.
>
> The slain man's father, Michael Berg, told reporters
> that his son met
> Moussaoui while riding the bus to classes, and had
> allowed the suspect to
> use his computer.
>
> But the 2002 FBI interview could explain the
> bureau's interest in Berg while
> he was detained by authorities in Iraq shortly
> before the militants
> kidnapped and killed him.
>
> Berg was picked up on March 24 and released on April
> 6. The details of that
> detention are the subject of a dispute between the
> Berg family and the U.S.
> government.
>
> The family contends Berg was detained by the U.S.
> military, and even filed
> suit seeking his release on April 5. The U.S.
> military says Iraqi police
> detained him. Iraqi police deny that.
>
> To back its claims that Berg was in U.S. custody,
> the family gave The
> Associated Press copies of e-mails from Beth A.
> Payne, the U.S. consular
> officer in Iraq.
>
> "I have confirmed that your son, Nick, is being
> detained by the U.S.
> military in Mosul. He is safe. He was picked up
> approximately one week ago.
> We will try to obtain additional information
> regarding his detention and a
> contact person you can communicate with directly,"
> Payne wrote to Berg's
> father on April 1.
>
> Payne repeated that Berg was "being detained by the
> U.S. military" in an
> e-mail the same day to Berg's mother, Suzanne. The
> next day, Payne wrote
> that she was still trying to find a local contact
> for the family, but added
> that "given the security situation in Iraq it is not
> easy."
>
> The government says the e-mail from Payne was false.
> State Department
> spokeswoman Kelly Shannon said Payne's information
> came from the Coalition
> Provisional Authority. The authority did not tell
> Payne until April 7 that
> Berg had been held by Iraqi police and not the U.S.
> military, she said.
>
> "As Mr. Berg had been released, the consular officer
> did not convey this
> information to the family because he was released,
> thankfully," Shannon
> said. "And we thought he was on his way."
>
> Coalition spokesman Dan Senor said Wednesday that
> Iraqi police arrested Berg
> in Mosul on March 24 because local authorities
> believed he may have been
> involved in "suspicious activities."
>
> In Mosul, police chief Maj. Gen. Mohammed Khair
> al-Barhawi insisted Thursday
> that his department had never arrested Berg and
> maintained he had no
> knowledge of the case.
>
> During his detention, Berg was questioned by FBI
> agents three times.
>
> Berg is believed to have been kidnapped days after
> Iraqi police or coalition
> forces released him. The family has blamed the
> government for keeping him in
> custody for too long while anti-American violence
> escalated in Iraq.
>
> Shortly before Berg's disappearance, he was warned
> by the FBI that Iraq was
> too volatile a place for unprotected American
> civilians and that he could be
> harmed, a senior FBI official, speaking on condition
> of anonymity, said
> Wednesday.
>
> Officials said the U.S. government warned Berg to
> leave Iraq, and offered
> him a flight out of the country, a month before his
> grisly death.
>
> The Bergs said they want to know if the government
> had received an offer to
> trade Iraqi prisoners for Nicholas Berg. On the
> videotape of his death,
> Berg's killers made a reference to a trade offer,
> but U.S. officials have
> said they knew of no such offer.
>
>
> Michael Berg said he wanted to hear President Bush
> address the issue.
>
> "I would like to ask him if it is true that al Qaeda
> offered to trade my
> son's life for the life of another person," Michael
> Berg said. "And if that
> is true, well, I need that information. . and I
> think the people of the
> United States of America need to know what the fate
> of their sons and
> daughters might be in the hands of the Bush
> administration."
> </snip>
>
>
>
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Re: virus: Nick Berg email I got
« Reply #14 on: 2004-05-15 14:25:31 »
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A more fitting object of outrage is the executioner.

No true progress has ever been made through finding fault in others.

When things like this happen, we are all, and none of us, to blame.
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First, read Bruce Sterling's "Distraction", and then read http://electionmethods.org.
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